Everton Banter Archive September 03 2016

 

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03 Sep 2016 20:26:27
New poster here to the site and enjoy reading the posts, since transfer deadline day been starting to think of the similarities between the early stages of martinez's appointment and that of moshiri's. We all fell for bobby BS and loved "the way he oozed class when he spoke"he became what we all wanted after us going stale and borin under motes. Now when he was found out we turned our anger to kenwright so moshiri rides into town and we turn him into the saviour we have cried out for, we love the way he speaks about out club, new stadium major signings big money spent, yet none have materialised I know it's early days but i seriously doubt the guy!

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{Ed025's Note - i dont doubt him at all sheeds, he is a business man who has made a billion because he is very astute and savvy when it comes to investment and that has been one of our major failings over recent years, have faith mate this guy is the real deal..and welcome aboard..

03 Sep 2016 21:14:31
I wanna believe too ed but why is a man astute and savvy textin the imbasile Jim white about his transfer dealings also his pursuit of Walsh to recruit gems at minimum spend to lead to massive profit is the way he is going to do his transfer business not like sheiks at city who spent millions building a winning team!

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{Ed025's Note - i think the jim white thing was trying to save face after getting shafted by that rat sissoko sheeds, walsh is not here to recruit cut price deals though he is here because he was the best available, if you want a sugar daddy your supporting the wrong side mate..and sky blue scarves are cheaper i hear..

03 Sep 2016 21:29:02
We 'All' did not wax lyrical on Martinez appointment, in fact I would argue that like the Club Badge, we 'All' were in the majority of objecting to Martinez appointment predicting quite rightly that the blokes CV had nothing on it whatsoever to change us from a top 8 side into a top 4 side and in fact as time went on he would have us closer to relegation. Thank goodness for Moshri and thank goodness that our beloved Bill saw commonsense.

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03 Sep 2016 21:46:06
So what football CV has moshiri apart from not spending money at arsenal to thank goodness for.

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03 Sep 2016 22:04:39
He may not have a football cv. He is not here to manage the football side of it. Walsh and rk are. He is here to manage the business side of it, which is the side we have struggled with.

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03 Sep 2016 22:22:40
And hopefully he manages our club with the same success as his business but In my opinion I think the previous transfer window and the pursuit of Walsh worries me.

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03 Sep 2016 22:59:36
Never wanted Martinez in the first place. I could be proved wrong on this one yet but I'm very happy Moshiri has come along. Dread to think where we'd be without him to be honest.

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04 Sep 2016 07:17:09
Unfortunately for us, the so called top 4 (which is now probably a top 6) was created prior to the fair play rules being implemented. Man Utd, Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea all had major investment into their grounds and squads prior to the fair play rules. So in effect they start ahead of us. There is nothing we can do about it. 6 years ago, Moshiris money and wealth would have meant we could have gone and signed player "X" or player "Y" in a similar fashion to Chelsea with Abromovich's money. Certain clubs such as Arsenal and Man Utd benefitted from organic growth to a bigger extent. ie relying on success and spending the profits from the success. Liverpool even robbed 200 million from 2 American businessmen if you remember? However, we have to face the facts that we "missed the boat". So what can we do about it now? Identify someone who has the experience of doing it organically with a successfulclub (Mr Moshiri) . then trusting him to employ the right manager (Mr Koeman) and also employing a scouting systemor person who is renowned for picking up lower end bargains and creating a half decent squad (Mr Walsh or perhaps the Southampton scouting system/ people) . I firmly believe we are doing this. I also know from my limited football experience that bringing youth through the ranks is the final piece of that jigsaw and I firmly believe we now have the structure in place for this. I did warn someposters on here that this will be a sort of 5 year plan timescale. and that Moshiri's money is really irrelevant. But his experience with the Arsenal and the fact he can loan/ invest will help. Oh and like NBTB I never wanted Martinez. For those with memories, me and Swan used to have some humdinging disputes on this and a few other issues but I was predicting chaos and got it! I saw our squad deteriorte whilst others were saying it was improving.

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04 Sep 2016 07:18:18
Sheedysleft. . Mate you just cannot draw comparisons with RM and FM

#1 Martinez was a proven failure and most of us had grave concerns about this from the get go!

#2 Moshiri is a proven grounded realist who knows what he wants and seems to usually gets what he wants!

One of them came to us with nothing but verbals the other one has come to us with hard earned cash,
I know which side my breads buttered so heads up buddy 😉.

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03 Sep 2016 21:31:40
What is wrong with wanting what City have achieved over a short space of time?

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{Ed025's Note - nothing at all mate, but we have to be realistic..

04 Sep 2016 08:05:29
Degs. . Excellent post good job mate! 😃.

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03 Sep 2016 19:38:24
Hi Eds way is it with some of these posters still moaning about this and that give it a rest it really is boring let's all look forward to some real football on the pitch and let the board get on with getting us a new sadium which I am sure they can deal with it better than all of us so called experts let's enjoy the ride happy days are here at last many thanks Eds, GuernseyBlue.

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04 Sep 2016 07:55:29
They are getting less and less with more blues feeling more positive.

It takes tome and when you've had 20 years of struggle it's hard to let go of that negativity.

I can't wait for that first brick being laid at our new stadium. Any negativity left by then will simply disappear.

For some seeing is believing and I get that. I believe we have good people at the club and trust them 100%. Our chairman has only ever wanted the best for us and when that stadium is up and running I'm getting a plane to fly over to thank him for everything he's done.

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04 Sep 2016 10:00:29
This guy Sheedy makes the rest of us moaners look like the true definition of positivity and the proverbial sun shining from our nether regions.

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{Ed025's Note - we can convert him BCT, he is a sheep who has lost his way and lost a bit of faith mate, but us shepherds can steer him in the right direction.. :)

03 Sep 2016 13:46:47
Good afternoon Blues and Cowpat Sid.

I saw Cowpat Sid's tweet regarding the loan EFC have apparently just taken out. Does anyone have an info regarding this and also how is this so well known?

I prey it's for the stadium, it's the only reasonable thing I could think it's for. Obviously not the transfer window, which by the way I think we did pretty well in.

Thanks in advance.

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03 Sep 2016 12:42:47
This forum is gettting to the stage where you can't voice your opinion, and it's getting annoying. If you make a comment about anything that's negative. You get jumped on. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
I thought the last day of transfers was a shower of rubbish. I did expect players in after management said they wanted more, and I think everyone expected it, and I think everyone expected Gabbi or Brahimi. Sissoko I'm actually pleased about. (Not bitterness just thought a massive punt at 30 mill)
I agree we have improved over the last 2 seasons already but so has everyone else and on the last day of transfers, everyone improved even more. This Enner guy. I will be astounded if he is an absolute gem, even youtube, only makes him look ok. I obviously want him to be a gem and obviously I support him in the year that follows.
I guess I just don't get how management have said Martinez was rubbish the team was rubbish and it needs massive improving. No one dare tell me, "we got Koeman, walsh" I know, and it's their job to improve the team and yes they are doing so. I just expected more hunger on the last day. I mean we ended up in profit. Gabbi and Brahimi was a complete joke in my eyes we were in talks for weeks. Surely there's only so long before you say sod it.

Well as ed said earlier if we finish 9th it's an improvement.

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{Ed025's Note - i respect opinions mowfee and for and against what happened on DDay i have no problem with, its only when they become repetitive and slagging the club off that it does my nut in, there are only so many times you want to hear how crap our club is and that moshiri is a fraud, or that BK is laundering money or that koeman wants to leave...in the end its our club and i will support them through the good and the bad times, yes we have faults but we are working to change things so lets just try and enjoy the ride mate..

03 Sep 2016 13:42:27
O Noooooooooo! We ended up in profit! That has to surely be a bad thing. Sorry I couldn't resist that Mowfee82. Good thing we ended with an improved team and didn't break the bank to do it.

Look Mowfee82 I don't know the first thing about you and I'm not getting personal. I'm not trying to keep things 100% positive either. Just some perspective is needed a lot on here imho. I've often quite regularly posted on here that everyone is entitled to there opinion.

I get where your coming from. I too had high hopes for deadline day. I would have loved if we signed Kone, Sissoko and Gabbi. In a way I kinda partly blame Moshiri for some of this backlash that is going on from some Everton supporters at the moment.

From the idea of him texting Sky and saying I'd imagine everyone were expecting something big to happen. It's hard to know who to believe but you'd have to believe he did because I'm sure he would of got the message out by now if there was no truth to it.

In that context the end of the transfer window is a let down. In the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter that much at all. It is a miniscule matter in with all the great things that have happened over the past 5 months.

So why concentrate on it? Why not put it behind us and not keep bringing it Up? Entitled to your opinion surely as everyone is but why do so many feel the need to post so frequently about the failings on deadline day.

Overall I think the majority would agree it was a successful transfer window. Why not post about that?

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03 Sep 2016 13:55:13
Transfer Window Fume – Relative or not?

Whilst personally I am as disappointed as most people that we didn’t manage to achieve our chosen targets and am annoyed with the way the window panned out, I do feel we need to have some perspective on this issue because of all the moans and ridiculous accusations being thrown around.

So here goes: We had an agreement with Zenit for Witsel but for whatever reason Witsel turned us down because he preferred to move to Juventus. This was the players’ decision (and he got his comeuppance on the last day when Zenit pulled the plug on his move to Juve. ) . NOT OUR FAULT!
Ghezzal: we had an agreement with his club also and made him an offer their Chairman said was almost twenty times his current deal. Yet the player turned us down because he wanted to play in Europe. All credit to the player for putting football reasons before person greed, very rare in today’s market. NOT OUR FAULT!
Perez: Again we had agreement with Deportivo and the player and it looked like completing. Yet Arsenal who said they were not interested in the player a week before, suddenly matched our offer. The player then decided to choose Arsenal because he wanted European Football. NOT OUR FAULT!

Gabbiadini: This deal was always dependent upon Napoli finding a replacement and according to his Agent Napoli really didn’t want to sell him. Hence they deliberately procrastinated throughout. NOT OUR FAULT!

Brahimi: This is a crazy one because of what happened. Initially we had a deal with the Club agreed and Terms with the player agreed. Porto suddenly decided to move the goal posts at the eleventh hour and increased the price. So we met that new asking price and agreed a new fee of 42m Euros. Yet again as the deal was about to be concluded they pulled out and said the price was now 50m Euros. Checking Portuguese Media I found that this was something Porto had done before, so it was not a surprise to the media. I also discovered that many African players have multi-owners and this also complicates such deals; in this case a Sports Company who had part ownership pulled the deal and asked for more money. They deny this however. NOT OUR FAULT!

Sissoko: This is very disturbing one for me because it seems clear that he and his Agent used Everton to secure a deal to Spurs. We had everything agreed with Newcastle and the player, even had a Private Jet on the runway waiting for him to bring him in for a medical. He didn’t show up and Koeman couldn’t get hold of him on the phone because he had turned it off. If people knew a little more about how Agents (the money men) work then these types of shenanigans will come as no surprise. Personally, I believe Sissoko’s attitude throughout this has shown that we have dodged a bullet and he is not the type of player with the right attitude for our great Club. His reason, he wanted European football. NOT OUR FAULT!

Does knowing all this make me less disappointed? NO, it doesn’t. But, it does allow me to apportion the blame squarely where it needs to be; with Martinez for destroying our reputation. If Kenwright had sacked him at Christmas last season instead of allowing him to make the situation worse we may have been able to salvage something from the season and therefore have been in a better position today to attract the kind of talent we required and wanted.

So I say to all the people fuming and blaming the Board and whoever else at the Club, please reflect somewhat and recognise the type of players we have been targeting, the likes of which we would never have targeted before. We showed our ambition but have sadly been let down by past failures. We will recover from this and learn valuable lessons. What we need to do now is pull together and ensure that we are in a good position fighting for Europe come January and then we may be able to strengthen the squad with the quality players we need and deserve!

Finally, Enner Valencia: When he signed for West Ham in 2014 he took the PL by storm. He was fast and scored some great goals and was entertaining and was an exciting player. Until he was badly injured that is. So let us give this lad a chance because he may prove to be an astute signing! He cannot be any worse than Kone or Niasse can he?

That’s it, my thoughts….

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03 Sep 2016 13:12:33
Well said mow.

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03 Sep 2016 14:10:18
Mowfee, don't take it personally. As you say, we all have the right to voice our opinions and concerns on here but there are some that post the same old comments and it becomes mundane. There are people still having a go at Kenwright, some who still have a go at RM etc etc. I see posts moaning because FM hasn't spent any cash bar what we received for Stones. Surely you can see how depressing this is? Some fans just come across as spoilt and ungrateful, deadline day for them was akin to getting a crap present on xmas day.
The problem is it seems to be the same posters who do this. It's like they get a perverse satisfaction from things not going for us, 'I told you so' type of attitude. It grates on the nerves after the tenth post of the same drivel.
I'm going to do the same as NBTB, I think a few weeks away from this site will do wonders before the negative brigade send me over the brink.

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03 Sep 2016 14:27:01
Well said steviegee! I'd challenge anyone to disagree with that post. On reflection from reading it I'd love to ask one question and one question only to anyone willing to answer. Who exactly should we of signed?

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03 Sep 2016 15:06:34
I say let's just put the past behind and move forward forget the whouse we didn't sign and support who we did sign. Just for arguments sake what if we did sign Brahimi and he got injured against Sunderland and was out for 6 months? Let's see were we are at Xmas with the current squad and then come back with the negative posts waiting for January, I for one feel we will be up and around the top 6 of the table.

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03 Sep 2016 18:57:14
Good post stevie.

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03 Sep 2016 21:42:31
Not necessarily who we should have signed NBTB but who we should have identified in the first place as the priority acquisition for Squad positions (having consulted with Walsh and Koeman) and then having done so, given the current financial circumstances, moved heaven and earth not to be gazumped. Having said that, we now have the majority of the backroom staff Moshri wishes (so I believe) and circumstances we have just found ourselves in during this Window will not happen again.

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04 Sep 2016 01:38:06
Thanks Stevieg, saved me typing that myself, spot on, had we brought in Williams, Gaye, Bolasie, Stek on transfer deadline Day, would have got a different reaction from some posters, the fact we brought them in early is overshadowing our deadline Day. Dealings.

Like I said on a different post, Everton were used to get players a better contract at their club, or entice champs league teams to match our bid.

The fact we didn't roll over and walked away from some of the goal posts moved targets, gets the thumbs up by me.

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03 Sep 2016 12:08:50
Hello fellow toffee's

I have to say this, but we all know youtube make's footballer's look good. But watching Enner Valencia looks ok at best, nothing amazing, made a few tackles then tried to run on got tackled himself. Now I know i'm not the brains inside goodison park, but I can a good player when I see one. I just don't see what he's going to bring

Now I have to write this next bit because some of you will all be like "How about suporting him and blah blah blah" (boring zzzz! ) all i'm saying is it will be interesting, being he is 26 and not a 18 young up and coming. Don't mention Vardy either.

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{Ed025's Note - he was purchased as a forward originally mowfee but west ham moved him into midfield, i heard he wanted the CF spot and has sulked a bit about that, after his injuries he was frozen out to a certain extent so he will see us as a chance to revive his career, i dont know how it will pan out mate but lets just give him a chance before we decide on how good or bad he really is..

03 Sep 2016 12:37:54
Exactly Ed025 at least give the guy a chance. Don't write him off before he even kicks a ball.

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03 Sep 2016 11:03:50
Hi fellow blues long time lurker first time poster.
I'm happy enough with how are club is moving forwards now after 3 years in reverse, so what if we didn't get a big name player, we have some cracking youth players and have improved with a bit of shrewd buying. Personally I'm not expecting miracles this season, but I believe we are at the beginning of an exciting journey and I'm happy to be holding a ticket for it.

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03 Sep 2016 11:38:37
Yeah mate. The rot was stopped just intime I hope. Signings by Koeman have been far better than Martinez (Lukaku aside)

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03 Sep 2016 09:01:42
Why are we all excited about having a billionaire on the board if we are governed by what we can spend we keep getting told on here that his billions mean nothing and he simply can't dig deeper into his own pockets I'm not saying I don't want him but just don't understand what's exactly is going on at our club nothing realy has changed I know it's early days but what really is the point of it all?

I said in earlier posts that we would not buy a big name player because they all want to play for the so called fashionable clubs and was told to be calm there was plenty of time left in the transfer window but I was right if we can't spend big or pay big wages because of the rules what's the point of him having plenty of money I just don't get it?

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{Ed033's Note - If Everton finish this Premier League somewhere in the top 10, it's an improvement over the last 2 seasons.

03 Sep 2016 10:01:02
''If Everton finish this Premier League somewhere in the top 10, it's an improvement over the last 2 seasons. ''

Cannot argue with that statemenet, however it's a bit like the weatherman/ woman stating that 'it will be cooler in the shade'

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03 Sep 2016 10:09:45
O my god! I think I'll have to take a break from this site. The fantastic start to the season and people are still moaning and complaining. Its depressing me on here.

What's really changed Skylark?

How about we headed hunted and poached the brains behind Leicester's success last season. Got a manager in place who will take us places. Improved the first 11 enormously in the transfer window and are getting a new stadium because of our new owner.

So you would prefer Martinez still in charge. Us scrapping at the bottom of the barrel in the transfer market. Have no stadium lined up and looking like we will still be playing in run down Goodison for the foreseeable future!

This site really does depress me. Do people never here of a thing called alternative's? The alternative to our new owner is what I've lined out in paragraph 4 above.

This is what some people want! Lord god give me strength.

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03 Sep 2016 10:44:10
It's going to take time skylark. Little bits at a time.

We've just signed 4 players for the 1st 11 for the first time in decades. A new manager, DOF and backroom team.

We've got a new investor that is well on the way to building a new house for all the toys to go in.

Stop over thinking things and just get on with supporting the team.

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03 Sep 2016 11:30:26
What the club needs to do is significantly increase its income - from sources other than television - and that certainly means a new stadium for higher match-day revenue and more lucrative commercial deals.
With that increased income, we will be able to spend more on transfers and wages (which should mean better players) under the FFP rules.
What FM brings to the table is: a strategy to achieve this; and the determination to bring in top people like RK and SW to deliver this strategy; and the business and financial contacts/ knowledge/ influence to get things done riight.
While he has the personal wealth to financially support the club, the club has to become self-financing and not rely on him hopefully being an eternally benevolent "sugar daddy".
The idea that we should expect - let alone feel entitled - to FM endlessly pumping his own money into our club for inflated transfer fees, massive wages, and bloated commissions for agents (not that the original poster suggested that) is, with all due respect to my fellow fans, naive and frankly ludicrous.
Whatever I might write, it's just my current opinion and all fans are entitled to express their own opinions and I happily read and enjoy those posts.
Once a Blue, always a Blue!

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{Ed025's Note - your opinions are usually correct in my book sid..

03 Sep 2016 11:47:21
Go easy on Skylark boys. I sort of understand the question he is asking. He is just pointing out that lots of posters were expecting lots of big money signings using Moshiri's money. This is not possible without having the business side of EFC being able to repay that money or FFP rules are broken and fines/ other punishments are dished out by the Eufa. He is asking quite legitimately what difference themoney from Moshiri makes. I have to agree on that point. I do believe we are moving forwards again and Moshiri is obviously part of this. but actually his money really has no significant part of it.

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03 Sep 2016 10:20:34
We have only finished outside the top 10 3 times I think out of the past 14 15 years so what big difference will finishing in the top 10 will that make? All a bit strange.

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{Ed033's Note - and finishing outside the top 10 the last 2 years tells you something is wrong, so finishing inside the 10 ten means Everton are heading in the right direction. This year may show Everton fans whether Ronald Koeman is a top manager or not and whether Everton are heading for bigger things.

If Everton can get into Europe, you'd expect big money to then be spent. But, obviously, spending money incorrectly like Liverpool doesn't do anything.

03 Sep 2016 12:27:35
Degsy had a feeling you would agree with his point of view. We all know where he is coming from. The point is we are in a far far better situation.

So what do you and Skylark want. Moshiri to walk away from the club and then we would be far less secure financially with no prospects of improving our stadium?

That would be the alternative. So that's what you's would want?

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03 Sep 2016 12:29:04
Very good post Sid. I also agree with Ed025 your posts are usually correct. Also informative at times. Never depressing.

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03 Sep 2016 13:51:48
Thanks degsy and sorry NBTB if I came across a bit negative I was just asking and stating that some of us go on about his millions a bit to much let's all get on hay.

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03 Sep 2016 14:33:04
Yeah no problem Skylark. No need to apologise as your entitled to your opinion.

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03 sep 2016 16:49:44
nbtb, i still think we will win the league we just make hard work of it ha ha.

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03 Sep 2016 18:57:34
NBTB, all I said was go easy on him for pointing out the money of Mr Moshiri is irrelevant at the moment. There is no need to be so confrontational all the time. No I don't want Moshiri to walk away. Yes I am happy we have turned a corner. no I don't see how his money makes all that difference when there are FFP rules to follow and we can't spend it without it being generated from footballing profits. Simples. By the way, 3 years ago I was one of the minorities who was against Martinez. I was accused of being negative then and almost had a witch hunt against me for not agreeing with everyone that we had found the messiah!

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03 Sep 2016 23:06:29
Didn't want Martinez myself Degsy. I was a Moyes man like yourself. Martinez is the total opposite to that. Think we'll have to disagree on Moshiri. Your point is irrelevant if his hands are tied. Doesn't matter who is the owner according to you.

O yea, there is the small matter of a new stadium. Where is the money going to come from for that? Moshiri? Guess he's good for something. An improved stadium will help generate more cash for the club and improve the financial and business end of things. The stadium is just one area Moshiri will help in this regard.

Its not all about spending on players.

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02 Sep 2016 20:36:28
Ed

Why is EFC taking out more loans?

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{Ed002's Note - I am not sure what has happened but it would not be unreasonable if Everton wanted to borrow money to take a loan and guarantee it against future income.}

 
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