Everton banter 58822

 

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15 Dec 2024 15:33:14
Almost all commentators and journalists etc etc today are spouting praise that we were excellent yesterday against the Gooners, particularly singing the praises of Myko, Young and Pickford, not a bad word to be said, so do we continue with this type of play get another 3 or4 draws against tough opposition and get the vital points or would some like attractive footy with no points, I certainly hate our sort of footy we played yesterday but give me the points anyday to losing, bit of a rock and a hard place eh, nothing will change until the new broom finally takes over, hope he's gone this week.

Agree9 Disagree0

15 Dec 2024 15:45:40
Exciting football showing some ambition. The badge doesn’t say timeo hoc facere (afraid to try)

15 Dec 2024 16:17:27
Nil satis nisi optimum meaning Nothing but the best is good enough, wonder if Sean knows the Everton motto?

15 Dec 2024 16:26:10
I don't mind losing if we go down fighting but there are two sides of the coin where football is concerned. You've got to defend as a team against these better teams ut you also have to have the courage to attack. Zero shots on target is disgraceful for a premier league team. Hopefully we don't have to put up with this anti football for too much longer, it's fecking draining.

15 Dec 2024 16:35:51
I’d take a point against each of Chelsea and City playing like that any day GB but it’s when he sets up with those tactics against teams at home when we could have more of a chance against them. Even Chelsea we’ve beaten before at home. He makes subs far too late when games have run away from us. He picks players out of form in the hope they do something. He refuses to give youth players a run out and get experience (even when 3-0 up after 60 mins) . The guy is infuriating.

Someone said this to me recently: “Be careful what you wish for. Look at what happened to West Ham after they ditched Moyes…”. It keeps going round my head. Same thing happened when Moshiri took over. Will we get the right person in to turn us around and get us consistently finishing in the top 10 again?

We can’t keep playing this style of football. It’s destroying our love of the game. The question is: who can get us playing football that we enjoy and win games? Who can set us up against harder teams to still get something out of the game without parking the bus for 90 mins? To those questions, I have no answers… that’s what depresses me.

15 Dec 2024 18:09:30
Also as well BR many of our players are simply not good enough, our takeover cannot come quick enough mate.

{Ed025's Note - thats a fair point GB but i still think if we were set up correctly and coached we still have a side to finish mid table comfortably mate..

15 Dec 2024 18:28:20
Agree Ed mate but just can’t see it as a good few of them would have trouble coping in the lower leagues, you just can’t make a silk purse from a sowes ear, we have to get rid once and for all.

{Ed025's Note - a few will have to leave obviously GB, but i still think we have the nucleus of a decent side mate and with reinforcements maybe a bit better than that..

15 Dec 2024 18:43:22
Hopefully We keep Pickford, Ndiaye, Branthwaite, Tarks, Mangala, Garner, O Brien, maybe one or two more the rest can go.

{Ed025's Note - works for me mate..

15 Dec 2024 18:52:35
Our best performance of the season so far yielded a 4-0 result. That shows us that with the right attitude we can score. Yes wolves are rank awful, but so have other teams been and we have lost to them with our pragmatic approach.

If we play with the attitude of winning then we will score and win some of those games. We will also lose a few. But we will accumulate enough points to create a gap between us and the bottom three. Then the fans will have something to shout about.

Now honestly we can’t expect SD to do this. It’s just not his way. Apart from the odd result we will feel pretty flat about the performance most weeks and that can’t go on. Get rid now, show some courage and recruit a manager who will restore some pride.

{Ed025's Note - spot on Ace..

16 Dec 2024 10:16:29
Forest supporters were saying a similar thing last season. Players not good enough etc. But a change of manager and style of play has worked wonders for them. Same with Villa a couple of seasons ago go. It can be done.

16 Dec 2024 11:16:55
Made some very decent signings as well tbf to them.

Still can't believe Milenkovic has ended up at them tbh. To see him stay at La Viola for so long and then move to Forest was quite perplexing. Quality defender and has now recently added goals to his performances.

Him and Murillo as a pairing is as good and physical as any in the Prem.

Young Anderson was a smart buy as well. Fee was laughed at in the media but he works his bollocks off and has racked up a fair few assists for them this season.

16 Dec 2024 14:26:06
Motto went out the window years ago, most noticeably when people wanted to keep Lampard because he was a nice fella. over being actually competent in football management

which funnily enough the current fella is, but get's dogs abuse.

16 Dec 2024 14:38:56
8 league wins in nearly whole a calendar year. In what way does that show competence?

16 Dec 2024 16:02:52
competence of staying up first year he got here

competence of staying up comfortably with a terrible side despite the biggest PL points deductions ever, despite it scraping by on final days in years prior with Richarlisons/ Iwobi's/ Gordon's

it's a bottom 5 squad max, not sure what amount of wins you're expecting with this squad over a season

can shout NSNO all you want, but when you're constantly selling your better attacking players and scrounging round for replacements how are you going to get better scoring goals. EFC's only strength right now is the defence and that's how we're set up

again, it's fine to say you want a change of how we play, we all do.

but the stick the current fella gets is absurd, genuinely ridiculous.

16 Dec 2024 16:58:20
Imo we stayed up because the fans pulled the players over the line and there were 3 teams that were slightly more dreadful than we were, it wasn't because of his competency as a manager.

Yes, we scraped to last days of season previously but that was under even poorer managers, so it isn't really hard to come out on top against an inexperienced manager like Lampard.

He never takes the opportunity to galvanise the players, all he does is dampen thoughts when somebody says something positive about them in the media. He just constantly cries about how bad it has been at the club before he got here and how we are trying to change the story, even though he has been in the job for what could certainly be considered by todays standard as a long time. He picks his favourites even though they have shown time and time again that they are not good enough e. g. Doucoure and Keane. His in-game management is absolutely horrendous and he never changes things, even when we are getting absolutely obliterated by 3+ goals.

Staying up with the points deduction, fair enough was a good achievement but again, look at the teams we were competing against. It used to be 40 pts to stay up and the bottom 3 got mid 20's or below.

I am under no illusions of how bad this squad is but there is still a nucleus of players that can adopt and carry a managers way of playing to be more positive than the utter dross we are served up.

Pickford
Tark
JB
Mangala
Gueye
Ndiaye
McNeil
DCL

Although I don't think some of the above are right for this club moving forward, they are still long-serving PL players or international footballers. There are teams that are doing a lot better than us, with a lot worse squads e. g. Bournemouth.

You mention Iwobi and Gordon, look how much they have improved since leaving us.

In terms of the stick he gets, he brings it on himself with his incessant arrogant and sarcastic persona he gives off towards the press and the fans. He speaks as if he has played at the highest level of the game and won things as a manager, when the best he achieved was a League 1 title as a player with Milwall and a Championship title with Burnley as a manager.

Again, this squad is poor but there are some good players within it. I simply can't accept that we are not good enough to setup with some attacking impetus at Goodison against the low to mid table sides in this division. I have absolutely no problems keeping things pragmatic against the better sides, especially on the road but we have no identity, we have no style. People used to know Dyche as a rigid 4-4-2, go long and make it stick, heavy crossing, intense and hardworking side but we don't even do that, even when we have the personnel to do so.

16 Dec 2024 18:22:02
Well said BN ???.

17 Dec 2024 08:56:27
The man has shown a total lack of competence. His obsession with only picking older players, and ignoring the younger ones is bordering on madness. Week after week he picks players who’s best days are clearly behind them, in the hope they will suddenly come good.
He has one tactic, and I am sure he would take 0-0 in every game just so he could talk about how defensively good we were.
His job when he came in was to keep us up and he’s done that. But that is as far as his ability goes. So if you want a manager to keep you up playing negative football, while always battling at the wrong end of the table, then Dyche is your man.
I don’t.

17 Dec 2024 09:18:52
you can talk about a handful of players being decent, but it's not enough in the PL to be higher than others.

McNeil doesn't start for many other sides outside of the promoted 3, purely because he's not quick enough and/ or consistent enough

we have the worst set of fullbacks in the division (credit Young this season but still)

Gordon improving since leaving us have nothing to do with Dyche seeing as he didn't play a game under him.

Iwobi, great what can happen when you're able to play natural position surrounded by better players and an overlapping LB isn't it?

the squad is turgid, the 2 best players this season are both over 35yrs old.

strongest positions are CB's GK and Gana Gueye, all defensive minded players so no wonder we're better at that than attacking

wingers, Ndiaye people have fell for, but he's not a winger, we've been starved that long of someone with normal ability to take a man on that you don't notice most sides have 3/ 4 of these players. you saw it just an example of Bournemouth's subs against us

same with Mangala, he's alright like, but you've been starved that much of a player whose semi-capable on the ball that we think he's brilliant.

the squad is awful, and us overperforming on points last season with it is a victim of own downfall of expectation this season.

width is so important in attacking in the PL, when you don't have fullbacks/ wingers capable of doing it at good level, you will always struggle.

again not saying Dyche is perfect, he should be doing better this season, but the criticism is so OTT.

17 Dec 2024 09:22:11
woburn, ever thought that the younger players don't play for a reason?

multiple reports of Jake O'Brien struggling in training.
Nathan Patterson has shown nothing and has no chance of getting in ahead of POTY thus far Ashley Young.
Tim Iroegbunam shown flashes but taken out at the right time as inexperience was costing us goals.

played Dobbin last year when nowhere near ready
played Dixon this year when nowhere near ready
Armstrong get's cameo's all be it nowhere near ready
Chermiti got sometime in the end when able last season
Branthwaite when brought up to speed was thrown in last season


not sure what other young players you want to be playing?

17 Dec 2024 10:07:25
I would say having 70% out of your starting 11 is more than a handful of decent players tbh.

You can't tell me that the likes of Forest, Brighton, Fulham, Bournemouth etc all have a starting 11 every week that don't carry average players within it.

Forest - Yates, Dominguez, Aina, Morato, Jota Silva
Brighton - Dunk, Van Hecke, Lamptey, Ayari
Fulham - Tete, Diop, Bassey, Castagne, Traore
Bournemouth - Smith, Cook, Christie, Kluivert, Outtara

It is not the overall quality of these teams that sees them above us in the table. It is their cohesive understanding of the system that they have been placed in and their unified belief in the tactical setup that the manager applies to each game. Their managers have the ability to preserve a tactical rigidity, whilst allowing enough freedom to the players to maximise their strongest and natural attributes.

Whilst each individual in the team knows exactly what is required of them as a unit, he still has his own unique abilities that he can utilise for the good of the team. We don't have that.

The players have zero freedom or license to express their own individual strengths. Look at our midfield for one. You could argue that Gueye, Doucoure, Mangala, Garner or even Onana last season are all very different players but you can't even tell them apart as they are all asked to the same job. This limits them and removes the opportunity for them to showcase their strongest attributes. Players are asked to curb their natural tendencies and instead, asked to deliver "the hard yards" type of performance that leads to a boring and stale game-plan, over being offensive and entertaining. This is exactly why Iwobi is performing. Do you not think that Mykolenko is capable of running beyond the winger? It is because he is clearly instructed not to and is shackled.

Look at the change in Bournemouth. The squad is exactly the same, possibly even worse when you take into account that they lost Solanke. Yet they are doing better than ever. It is simply the manager and the methods that he asks his team to adopt.

Look at Brighton under Graham Potter. He took over a team full of superstars did he? No, they were full of average players that had been coached by Chris Houghton, a highly defensive-minded manager. Potter instantly turned them into a high-pressing, aggressive counter-attacking team that were decent in possession. The personnel stayed the same - Shane Duffy, Propper, Stephens, Murray - hardly world beaters.

You mention Iwobi and Gordon. No, there are more. Lookman, Moise Kean, hell even Maupay is doing alright at Marseille. So are these bad players or are they just bad players in this horrendous environment that the club has conjured up for them?

Your point about McNeil is just untrue. Whilst I am not mad on the lad personally. He is effective if utilised correctly and would be even more so under a better manager. His set-piece delivery is praised by many people in the game. His technique isn't too shabby. Yes he may not have pace but neither do many players that are considered in the higher echelons of the league e. g. Odegaard, Palmer, Maddison, Fernandes, Paqueta - the list goes on.

Listen, by no means are our players world-class but they are better than relegation players. Most of them are either seasoned PL players or internationals in fairly decent sides.

You comment on our better players being defensive, which is absolutely evident but with such a good defence, shouldn't that allow the attacking players a little more freedom to go and force the issue? A logical answer would be yes. So why doesn't it happen - the manager is why.

You misunderstand that our players aren't capable of doing basic things in a game of football like running down a wing and overlapping. These are professional athletes, playing at the sports highest level. They are more than capable, they are just instructed not to.

17 Dec 2024 10:12:04
Wblue2, never seen a report anywhere that O’Brien has struggled in training, in fact Dyche has praised him about it.
Patterson has been injured and had very little playing time, and let’s not forget Young was a liability when he first came into the team, now you have him as POTY?
Tim was not responsible for our poor form, and was not taken out, he was injured.
As for the others. Dobbin never really given a run of games, but would have him ahead of Harrison any day.
Dixon not given enough games, the lad is quick and likes to get forward. Not something Dyche wants from his full backs.
Armstrong not seen him so can’t comment, though seems you have already made your mind up on that one. What I would say is could he be any worse than Dacoure?
Chermiti been injured so who knows?
Branthwaite not even a discussion.
This squad is not over performing, it’s stagnating. Players are being asked to play with fear. Fear of losing. They are not being allowed to play open attacking football because that is not Dyche’s way.
But hey let’s just keep on playing the likes of Dacoure and Harrison because the younger players just aren’t ready. Really? We probably will never know with this clown in charge.

17 Dec 2024 11:35:46
who are you wanting to play RW of 'younger players' instead of Harrison?

just plucking kids out the academy randomly and trying them even though they're nowhere near it?

17 Dec 2024 11:47:25
how is it relevant in this discussion of Dyche of what other players are doing post EFC before his time? if anything it highlights just how much of a basket case the club is and hard to manage.

you're talking Brighton's and Bournemouths. again they have pace

that run Iraola started last season with 9/ 10 of you on here would have been wanting him sacked because the fanbase has absolutely zero patience and just expects everything handed to them.

Brighton under Potter, again most of you don't have the patience for a rebuild, you want some miracle man to walk in and have wavering unrealstic expectations.

bournemouths players are coached to suit their strengths, 'they've just sold Solanke! ' and replaced him with what would be a near enough club record signing for us in a 40 odd million man from Porto?

they have pace in abundance.

look at brighton, yeah look at brighton. Mitoma/ Adingra/ Minteh/ Pedro/ Welbeck/ Baleba/ Estupinan/ Weiffer/ Mitoma/ Ferguson/ Rutter

they spent as much on Minteh than we did the whole of last summer near enough, you are in mad land if you think our squad is anywhere near theirs.

honestly just really unrealistic, on McNeil, ask any recruitment special-ist if he would be on the shortlist for a PL winger in 2025

your comparing his pace with central players of quality out of this world, McNeil can't use his right foot and runs in circles to stay on his left with no pace/ ability to get past a fullback.

70% of our squad is good? no it isn't you've missed the point entirely, the only decent players EFC have of standout is Branthwaite, Gana and Pickford.

youre talking about keep on playing likes of Doucoure and Harrison, like we have other options in the youth ranks, when we don't.

you'd have Dobbin ahead of Harrison? same Dobbin whose on loan at West Brom and can't get a look in?

madness people think just because they're young they're better, absolutely kills me off.

Iroegbunam by the way, benched for leicester, benched for palace and benched for Newcastle before injury, so YES he was dropped and rightfully so.

at least do basic research before trying to go in to detail.

17 Dec 2024 14:08:36
My point is that you are making out this squad is bad and I am saying you are chatting absolute waffle, which is unequivocally supported by the fact that many players who leave us go on to improve their performances.

Bournemouth have pace? First I have seen. Brighton have 1 quick player in Minteh.

Do you mean the run he went on at the start of last season in his first few games in the job? Much like the run we showed at the start of this season.

Potter didn't require patience, he changed them instantaneously and took under 10 games for Iraola. He had Liverpool, Spurs, Chelsea, Arsenal and Brighton in his first 10 games.

What do you mean Bournemouth players are coached to suit their strengths? Don't you think that all managers should coach to their players strengths? Just because 40 million has been spunked, does not make the player anywhere near the level of who he is replacing, as seen with Darwin Nunez across the park.

Pace in abundance is such an overstatement.

When you list Brighton players off, are you saying they are all pacey? Adingra and Minteh have pace, the others have average pace. If you are listing their players off comparing ability. Mitoma, no more ability than Ndiaye, just allowed to play his game. Adingra - prolific this season isn't he. Minteh the same, 2 goals. Pedro is a quality player. Welbeck has had his first good season in years. He hasn't got past 6 goals since he left United. Baleba is no better than what we have. Estupinan has zero clean sheets and 1 assists. Weiffer can't even get in the team. You talking about doing research is brilliant.

Their attack makes ours look pathetic but our defence makes theirs look the same, so not really sure what you are getting at. As a squad, they are similar.

I said that 70% of our starting 11, so try to keep up.

Also stop being disingenuous and trying to make out I have made some of the points other posters have. I haven't mentioned Doucoure, Harrison or Dobbin once.

Pickford - better than Kepa/ Verbruggen
JB - Better than any of their cb's
Tark - As good as anything they have bar Zabarnyi.
Gueye - Granted, getting on but as good as any dm in their sides.
Mangala - Comfortably the best ball retention mid out of the 3 teams. Plays for Belgium but apparently he is s*** haha.
Garner - Walks into either of their teams and that is across multiple positions btw. Better than Smith and Veltman at rb. Better than any cm's they have.
Tim - Young lad, great attributes and started the season as our only bright spark and you are slating him.
Ndiaye - Gets into Bournemouths side with ease. As much ability as Mitoma or Rutter. I bet you he would be on plenty of goals and assists if you give him to their manager.
McNeil - gets in Bournemouths team. Granted not Brightons.

Kerkez, Zabarnyi, Semenyo, Evanilson would be the only players who improve our side and then behind Brightons front 5 positions, only Estupinan would improve us and that is only because Myko is that bad. Baleba would do no better a job than what we have.

You are delusional. Give our squad to Iraola or Hurzeler and we would be top half of the table. Give Dyche Bournemouths and Brightons and they would be in the exact same position that we are, if not worse.

17 Dec 2024 15:38:53
Diallo aged 21 Man Utd best player against City. Nobody had heard of him and previous manager didn’t give him a chance. Probably thought none of the younger players are any good. Get another manager in and lo and behold he finds a gem.
Dyche will never be that manager. So to say we have no good young players is nonsense. We don’t know because their never given a chance.

18 Dec 2024 10:38:10
NOBODY HAD HEARD OF HIM!?!

He cost £20mill hahahaha.

18 Dec 2024 15:47:02
So did Beto had you heard of him? Don’t bust a gut answering.

18 Dec 2024 20:04:47
We will only know the real answer to all this when we have a new manager. Let’s hope it’s not too long ‘eh.





 

 

 
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